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Explanation of Bud Jones Poker Chip Styles -- V7, V6, S2

Discussion in 'Poker Chip Advice' started by tomb1, May 8, 2007.

  1. tomb1

    tomb1 Well-Known Member

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    Explanation of Bud Jones Poker Chip Styles -- V7, V6, S2
    by tomb1

    There has been a good deal of confusion about the types/styles of Bud Jones chips out there, especially as we've been focusing on the WSOP chips recently. I'd like to clear this up based on the latest information directly from GPI.

    Some of the confusion is due to the naming structure of the BJ chips by GPI. And it has been compounded by the fact that GPI's web site is outdated -- it does not list the current BJ models available. Finally, some of the confusion comes from us (me included). We've heard things on the grapevine that weren't completely accurate, and made assumptions based on outdated GPI information. So for my part in sowing this confusion, I want to apologize and try to set things straight.

    The bottom line is that the WSOP chips are the "S2" product line, neither "V6" nor "V7." This is the same as the Caesars at Sea chips recently made available, a solid-plastic chip with a B-size decal and a single-ring mold design.


    BUD JONES CHIPS IN GENERAL

    BJ chips were created to provide an alternative to clay chips. Bud Jones (yes, there really was a Bud Jones -- he started the company and lived until 2001) decided to make injection-molded plastic chips. He cooked up a special mixture of plastic compounds to make the chips slightly soft to the touch, yet very durable.

    He started first with coins in the center for a unique look, then moved to colorful printed decals for great customization by casinos. He continued to utilize more complex injection-molding equipment to produce very intricate injection patterns, including casino names, denominations, etc. With the decal chips, he still included a weighted metal slug in the middle to achieve the desired weight.

    Another innovation was that BJ chips were machine-finished after coming out of the injection molding process -- they are precisely cut to ensure their exact size, completely flat surface, and perfect edges.

    BJ was combined with Paulson and the French company B&G to create Gaming Partners International (GPI), a public company but majority owned by the French investors. B&G made chips similar to BJ chips, and they have maintained the two separate product lines since the merger. All Bud Jones chips are made at the GPI-USA facility in Las Vegas.


    BUD JONES "V6" FAMILY OF CHIPS

    The V6 line of chips is very similar to the original chips invented by Bud Jones. Most V6 chips are coin-center chips -- molded plastic around twin coins in the center. There are also V6 decal chips, with an inner metal insert but with printed decals instead of the coin on each side. There is a unique set of mold designs for V6 chips, characterized by a single molded design between the coin and the edge. The V6 mold allows only an A-size decal or coin in the center (the smallest decal size).

    The three types of V6 chips are:
    • V6 -- V6 mold designs, internal metal slug, printed A-size decal (weighing about 11 grams)
    • V6N -- same as V6 decal chips except with no metal insert, they are solid plastic (9 g)
    • V11 -- current name for V6 coin center chips (12+ g)
    Here are some pictures of V6 chips:

    [​IMG]


    BUD JONES "V7" FAMILY OF CHIPS

    The V7 line of chips was the successor to the V6 chips, and incorporated many features requested by casinos. Almost all V7 chips use a printed decal, and the decals are available in 3 sizes:
    • A size, approximately 31/32", and it may have a foil ring printed around the inside edge of this area
    • B size, approximately 1-1/8"
    • C size, approximately 1-5/16" and almost the full size of the chip.
    V7 chips have a unique set of mold options, characterized by an outer ring design plus another inner ring design. Casinos can mix these designs if they wish, so they can create something of their own. In addition, BJ will create custom injection patterns if desired. The multi-pass injection process allows BJ to produce 2, 3, and even 4-color molds. See the end of this thread for the V7 mold options.

    As noted above, V7 chips are machine-finished after injection for perfectly consistent surfaces. These chips may be produced with a beveled edge if desired.

    The V7 A-decal chips are often thought to have a magnetic center. In fact, the chips have a natural suction effect caused by the perfectly finished smooth surfaces and slightly indented inlays. But the metal inlays are non-magnetic brass. Since the A-decal chips have the most surface area of the plastic compound, the suction effect is most pronounced. By contrast, the B and C-decal chips have little of this suction.

    V7 chips are also available as a coin-center chip, though this is rare.

    There are four types of chips in the V7 family:
    • V7 -- standard V7 chips with A-size decal (weighing about 11-12 grams)
    • V8 -- V7 chips with a modified mold design and the mid-size B-size decals, formerly called V7-B chips (12 g)
    • V9 -- V7 chips with a modified mold design and the largest C-size decals, formerly called V7-C chips (10-11 g)
    • V10 -- coin-center V7 chips (12 g)
    Here are some pictures of V7 chips:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    BUD JONES "S" FAMILY OF CHIPS

    Some years ago, B&G started producing an intermediate line of injection molded chips called the S2 line. This line was "transplanted" from France and became the newest line of Bud Jones U.S. chips. They have the same name and similar mold patterns, but are different chips from the French S2 chips. The BJ "S" chips are manufactured in Las Vegas.

    These chips use a similar material to the V7 chips, but not exactly the same compound. The material has a slightly different feel (at least to me), but still the typical BJ combination of a hard surface and a soft touch. These chips may be produced with a metal slug, or as solid-plastic unweighted chips.

    The "S" chips are produced with the B-size decal, so there is almost 1/4" of molded plastic on each side of the inlay. This allows enough area for colorful mold designs.

    This line has its own unique line of mold designs (originally designed for computer-assisted optical recognition, though that was not widely accepted). They are single-ring mold designs, with only one area containing the design, unlike the V7 chips where two rings can be combined. But there are dozens of mold designs available, and BJ will make custom injections if desired by a casino. The S mold designs are not produced on V7 chips, and vice versa.

    The designs on the face of all BJ chips are molded at the same time as the edge, so that each design element on the face is perfectly aligned with the edges.

    There are two types of chips in the S family:
    • S2 -- multi-colored, B-size decal, unique S molds with a solid plastic center (no metal insert and weighing about 9 grams, close to a clay chip)
    • S -- same chips but molded around a weighted metal insert in the center of the chip (11 g)
    To answer a recent question: the chips recently seen at the WSOP are Bud Jones S2 chips. The Bellagio high-stakes tournament chips are also S2s.

    Here are some pictures of S chips:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    ONE LAST ITEM: MORE DETAIL ON THE V6/V7 MOLD DESIGNS

    For those of you with an interest in the detailed mold designs available, here are some pictures of the V6 and V7 families. There may be other combinations not shown, and some casinos have unique designs that are not published. I do not have any pictures of the available S2 molds.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    #1
    Last edited by a moderator: May 5, 2008
    justsomedude likes this.
  2. tastic

    tastic Well-Known Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Excellent review Tom! Very informative for clay guys like me who don't know much about bud jones chips! Thanks! :cool:
     
    #2
  3. 99%evil

    99%evil Banned

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Could you do us a favor? If you are going to post about BJ chips, could you at least do a little homework and maybe tell us something?

    :wink:

    Just kidding, great info, this should be shoved in the review/archive section.
     
    #3
  4. toblat

    toblat Well-Known Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    wow, very thorough, great review of the different types of BJ chips.
     
    #4
  5. Captn_All_In

    Captn_All_In Creativity Alliance

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Excellent stuff! This has answered so many of my questions!!

    Thanks!
     
    #5
  6. noelsarchs

    noelsarchs CCGTCC Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Had to post this picture now so I can see what version these are....V7 it seems.

    [​IMG]
     
    #6
  7. tonypap

    tonypap CCGTCC Member
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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Hey, michael, I think you should slice through one of those $500s to see if it's slugged...!!! :wink:
     
    #7
  8. 7cland7

    7cland7 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    :spade:very well done, thanks for the info :spade:
     
    #8
  9. Gaming Ore

    Gaming Ore Super Moderator
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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Tom,

    How very, very excellent.

    Tell me, in the V6 family, the V6 plastic and the V11 (CIC) plastic are two different componds, right?

    Jim (Gaming Ore) Follis
     
    #9
  10. tomb1

    tomb1 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    WARNING -- CHIP ABUSE AHEAD!

    No need to waste a good Max V7 . . . it's already been done.

    Here is a V7-A chip from Commerce Casino (note the customized mold pattern) showing the plastic material molded around a solid, perfectly round brass slug. The half-label was removed so you can see underneath.

    [​IMG]
     
    #10
    Last edited: May 8, 2007
  11. tomb1

    tomb1 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Something GPI will not talk about openly is their secret recipe (like Colonel Sanders' "11 herbs and spices"). That goes for their Paulson clay recipe as well as the Bud Jones recipe. And I suspect that the BJ compounds might have changed over the years, based only on the chips I have felt and their ages.

    So I don't know the answer to your question. The latest V6 decal chips like the Isle of Capri-Biloxi feel different from most of the CICs, so I'd lean toward a slightly different formulation. But I don't really know if it's the compound or the finishing or something else. And the V6 compounds generally feel harder to me than the V7s.
     
    #11
  12. Dwight87

    Dwight87 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    tomb1, that was an excellent read for me. It cleared up a lot of confusing questions I had regarding the WSOP and the recent release of the Ceasars Palace at Sea chips. The info also validates for me that Bud Jones V7 are top notch, quality chips. Thanks.
     
    #12
  13. HarrysAllOut

    HarrysAllOut Faux Clay Nation

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Thanks for such an informative post. Never realized they were all so different.
     
    #13
  14. Gaming Ore

    Gaming Ore Super Moderator
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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Tom,

    AGAIN, an excellent post! Kudos!

    In my scan I believe the Stardust chip is a V11 from the V6 Family, but the Colorado Belle chip is not. However, they are both made of a harder plastic, and the edges are as sharp as any brand new, uncirculated Paul-Son clay composition chip!

    The reason I say the Colorado Belle chip is not a V11, is because it is assembled differently. I've not seen a V11 opened up, but do you know if the two CICs are attached (welded or glued) back-to-back, or are they two separate coins?

    In the case of the Colorado Belle, they two separate coins. By looking at the V11, it looks like the CICs are molded into the plastic, but for the Colorado Belle the CICs are inserted into the center and a plastic retaining ring is used to hold the CICs in. This of course significantly changes the manufacturing process!

    Anyway, where does the Colorado Belle type chip fit in? (If you know.)

    [​IMG]

    Thanks,

    J(GO)F
     
    #14
  15. MCPallesen

    MCPallesen Well-Known Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Tomb1, thanks for clearing all this up. Very informative!

    /MC
     
    #15
  16. bbb_forever

    bbb_forever Well-Known Member

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    Avoid the injection, get the compression.
    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Give THE MAN (tomb1) some chips!!!

    Great review and photos!
     
    #16
  17. tomb1

    tomb1 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    All the CIC chips I have seen opened up have two separate stamped coins. (But I have never cracked open any of the real old original BJ chips, which I've heard had one solid coin.) The two coins don't seem to be welded or glued together, but just sit very tight in the mold perfectly.

    The Stardust chip certainly looks like a V6-type mold, so it would be a V11. Here it is cracked open:

    [​IMG]

    The Colorado Belle chip has the V7 mold design, so it would appear to be a V10 chip. As far as the edges, the V7 family of chips can be finished with a variety of square or beveled edges. I've seen them all the way from completely sharp/square like you describe, to slightly rounded, to a very fancy chamfered finish. So I don't know if the CIC chips are always square or could be more beveled if the casino requested.

    Here is a picture Greg Cagle took of two broken chips, and it looks like the Belle has 2 separate brass coins:

    [​IMG]
     
    #17
  18. Strange

    Strange Creativity Alliance

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    This is a great thread Tom. Huge rep to you.

    I hate plastic chips though

    :) :) :)
     
    #18
  19. noelsarchs

    noelsarchs CCGTCC Member

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    You just have to pay homage to anyone who collects tons of chips, but to disassemble them to see how they are constructed is a true chipaholic at it's finest!

    [​IMG]



    [​IMG]
     
    #19
  20. Brewster

    Brewster the office ninja

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    Re: Explanation of Bud Jones chip styles -- V7, V6, S2

    Outstanding post Tomb! :)

    That clearly explains the difference in the various BJ chips on the market these days.

    There is much wanton chip destruction in this thread. There should be a warning in the title.


    Much + rep for you Tomb. :happy:
     
    #20

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