[osumike11379]

If you do re-raise....I'll learn how to get this right eventually - yeah I knew someone could have been limping with AA, KK, QQ and I shouldn't have pushed....

ARGGH

PokerStars Game #16638394992: Tournament #84273003, $6.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level II (15/30) - 2008/04/10 - 22:20:26 (ET)
Table '84273003 1' 9-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: rewpa (1420 in chips)
Seat 2: bdiek (1440 in chips)
Seat 3: cubxwin (1030 in chips)
Seat 4: dkgg113 (880 in chips)
Seat 5: Tex Willie (2190 in chips)
Seat 6: polka711 (2340 in chips)
Seat 7: osumike11379 (1500 in chips)
Seat 8: ruellia (1000 in chips)
Seat 9: SihtHappens (1700 in chips)
polka711: posts small blind 15
osumike11379: posts big blind 30
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to osumike11379 [Js Jh]
ruellia: folds
SihtHappens: calls 30
rewpa: folds
bdiek: calls 30
cubxwin: folds
dkgg113: raises 60 to 90
Tex Willie: folds
polka711: folds
osumike11379: raises 180 to 270
SihtHappens: calls 240
bdiek: folds
dkgg113: calls 180
*** FLOP *** [6s 2h Qs]
osumike11379: bets 300
SihtHappens: calls 300
dkgg113: raises 310 to 610 and is all-in
osumike11379: raises 620 to 1230 and is all-in
SihtHappens: calls 930
*** TURN *** [6s 2h Qs] [4s]
*** RIVER *** [6s 2h Qs 4s] [5d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
osumike11379: shows [Js Jh] (a pair of Jacks)
SihtHappens: shows [6h 6c] (three of a kind, Sixes)
osumike11379 said, "of course"
SihtHappens collected 1240 from side pot
dkgg113: shows [Qc Tc] (a pair of Queens)
SihtHappens collected 2685 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 3925 Main pot 2685. Side pot 1240. | Rake 0
Board [6s 2h Qs 4s 5d]
Seat 1: rewpa folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: bdiek folded before Flop
Seat 3: cubxwin folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: dkgg113 showed [Qc Tc] and lost with a pair of Queens
Seat 5: Tex Willie (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: polka711 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 7: osumike11379 (big blind) showed [Js Jh] and lost with a pair of Jacks
Seat 8: ruellia folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: SihtHappens showed [6h 6c] and won (3925) with three of a kind, Sixes

[Lime]

I actually don't think I would have re-raised pre-flop. I generally like to see a flop with jacks early in the game. I'd rather keep the pot smaller. Because of your re-raise the pot is at 885 on the flop. If you just called and the same people called behind the pot would be only 465.

I also would have checked the flopped since the Q hit. (It's tough playing out of position like this.) Since you bet and were called and then someone came over the top. I would be thinking I'm beat at this point.

Fold and you've still got 930. Plenty enough to wait for a better spot.

My thoughts anyway. Hope that helps.

D.

[BassVillan]

Originally Posted by Lime

I actually don't think I would have re-raised pre-flop. I generally like to see a flop with jacks early in the game. I'd rather keep the pot smaller. Because of your re-raise the pot is at 885 on the flop. If you just called and the same people called behind the pot would be only 465.

I also would have checked the flopped since the Q hit. (It's tough playing out of position like this.) Since you bet and were called and then someone came over the top. I would be thinking I'm beat at this point.

Fold and you've still got 930. Plenty enough to wait for a better spot.

My thoughts anyway. Hope that helps.

D.

Pretty nice insight here. If it were later in the sng and blinds/antes were substantial I would most likely be shoving here. I can't say that I dislike your raise here but just calling with JJ has it's advantages as described above. JJ is a tough spot sometimes. And the guy flopping the set? What can you do, his call pre flop was gamblish at best, I don't like it at all. And the guy with Q-10, well, a good hoove trimming is in line for that animal.

[tomb1]

So you got another JJ hand! Those F'n Jacks....

Pre-flop: with two limpers (yet to act again) and a raiser in front of you, that's a tough spot with JJ. Playing this hand in a possible 4-way pot -- out of position -- is tricky. So to get down to just one caller, I think you need to raise at least $360. Then the question is, do you even want to play jacks for that much of your stack at the 2nd blind level?

I think I just call the raise here this time. At this point we're looking for a set, so you can just treat your JJ as a 99. Depending on what we know about the other players, I'd even consider folding.

After the flop: down to 3 players, I'm about 50/50 to check or bet. Dkgg will push unless he totally missed, so you're really committing 610 chips if you bet 300. The other guy is unknown, the hazard of playing out of position.

So I probably check here after the flop.

And then I fold to the push, with one more player to go who's already called your bet.

And I definitely don't re-raise all-in. The only reason for you to push here is to build the pot when you have the nuts. Your remaining chips aren't enough to get the 3rd guy to fold.

So I'd keep a multi-way pot OOP smaller not bigger with JJ.

As far as the 66 calling pre-flop -- that's a little loose but he had great implied odds. He bet 270 to get 3925 when he hit his set! Personally, I'd fold 66 to a raise ands re-raise, but I can understand why he'd gamble a little.

[thkvl]

If you wanted to reraise preflop, I would have to agree with tomb1, and raise to at least 360. The reason being that with multiple limpers in the pot, you should pot or a little more than pot to isolate. There's 45 in blinds + 30 + 30 + 90 + 90 (your call), so that's 285 in the pot. 90 + 285 = 375. This seems like an extremely high amount with blinds only at 15-30 (it's 1/4 of your stack), so smooth calling or even folding would be more correct.

However, I think the problem lies with the postflop play.
*** FLOP *** [6s 2h Qs]
osumike11379: bets 300
SihtHappens: calls 300
dkgg113: raises 310 to 610 and is all-in
osumike11379: raises 620 to 1230 and is all-in
SihtHappens: calls 930

You reraised preflop, so you led out with a continuation bet to see where you stood with your JJ, I think that's fine. But someone smooth called with people behind, and another person went all in. What could you possibly beat with JJ in this spot? You'd probably have to put someone on AQ (like dkgg as he raised preflop and called your raise, and he pushed on a Q high flop). So if you put dkgg on AQ, what can siht possibly have to smooth call your bet, when he limped/called preflop in early posiiton (a usually a good indicator of a mid pocket pair). He probably would have originally raised with JJ+, so you can leave the overpair out. So when he smooth calls your bet on the flop, you probably have to put him on a set here, and muck your hand.

[jspearm1983]

Originally Posted by thkvl

You reraised preflop, so you led out with a continuation bet to see where you stood with your JJ, I think that's fine. But someone smooth called with people behind, and another person went all in. What could you possibly beat with JJ in this spot? You'd probably have to put someone on AQ (like dkgg as he raised preflop and called your raise, and he pushed on a Q high flop). So if you put dkgg on AQ, what can siht possibly have to smooth call your bet, when he limped/called preflop in early posiiton (a usually a good indicator of a mid pocket pair). He probably would have originally raised with JJ+, so you can leave the overpair out. So when he smooth calls your bet on the flop, you probably have to put him on a set here, and muck your hand.

Ditto. Couldn't have said it better.

[jojobinks]

preflop is okay. i baffled by the flop play though. why????

[osumike11379]

Originally Posted by jojobinks

preflop is okay. i baffled by the flop play though. why????

I really don't know why I shoved in terrible play on my part so that is awful - do you think the bet of 300 before the shove was awful?

[jojobinks]

Originally Posted by osumike11379

I really don't know why I shoved in terrible play on my part so that is awful - do you think the bet of 300 before the shove was awful?

nah, considering the preflop raise i'd say it's pretty much mandatory. the flop is too safe to give up there.

ps: some will come in and say you should bet more on the flop. i recommend you not listen to them.

pps: similarly to the thread last week, i think you should consider not reraising preflop here.

[Poboy]

Raise preflop is fine, but put shorty in.