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09-07-2006, 10:55 AM
| | On the Bubble | | Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Seattle Age: 30
Posts: 62
Chips: 120 | | | Playing Kings I think I played this had right, but I'm looking for feedback.
It's a 7 person single table tournament. It's early and the blinds are at $20-$40. Starting stacks are $2500 and right now I have $1700 left.
I'm in the cutoff. One fold and then two limpers to me. I look down at Kings. I make it $150 to go. The button raises to $300. It's folded around to me and I make it $1000. The button thinks for about a minute before he calls. I know his play pretty well, and decide he wouldn't have reraised me with any unpaired hand (it's not his style). I don't think he would have had to think that hard if he had Aces, Kings, or Queens; so I put him on a mid pocket pair Sevens to Jacks. The flop comes down 2-4-J rainbow. Action is on me. What do I do? | 
09-07-2006, 11:05 AM
|  | Final Table | | Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Age: 29
Posts: 735
Chips: 634 | | | Re: Playing Kings You only have one choice with the amount of money already in the pot you have to push. If he has jacks then you just got caught. | 
09-07-2006, 11:15 AM
|  | World Series Final Table | | Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: TN
Posts: 2,446
Chips: 2,456 | | | Re: Playing Kings so this is live, not online, right?
I would've raised more pre-flop, 20/40/40/40, so 140 in the middle already.
I would've raised in the neighborhood of 200-225 to price out hands like A5 suited, 89 suited and other hands that would limp, but not raise.
When you reraised to a thousand, coupled with your previous raise to 160. You've committed 1160 of 1700 and there's now 2460 in the middle and you have 540 left, you're all-in period. You aren't going to throw KK away here and you can't bet any amount, but all of it.
I may've delayed my action a bit after the flop, if I didn't get it all-in already. Let him consider I've gone crazy with AK or similar and am just working up the courage to bluff. He is pretty much obligated to call here for the price.
If he pulled a John Juanda here, you're pretty much stuck with saying 'nice play' and walking away. John Juanda has this move, he raises or limps with AA, and if you raise him and he reads you as very strong, he only calls, he doesn't reraise you pre-flop in the hopes of getting your whole stack after the flop. | 
09-07-2006, 11:18 AM
|  | Big Stack | | Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: CA$H game at 3-Creek Ranch Age: 53
Posts: 1,982
Chips: 18 | | | Re: Playing Kings Got to agree with burnvalley & GUN. You have to go ahead and push now, and hope he's bluffing.
Last edited by Jambine : 09-07-2006 at 11:36 AM.
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09-07-2006, 11:26 AM
| | On the Bubble | | Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Seattle Age: 30
Posts: 62
Chips: 120 | | | Re: Playing Kings I did push. And you'll never believe what he turned over. Pocket Twos giving him a set. I didn't hit another King, and was out early.
I think I should have pushed pre-flop. | 
09-07-2006, 11:30 AM
|  | Final Table | | Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Age: 29
Posts: 735
Chips: 634 | | | Re: Playing Kings Super donk play by that guy. Can't do anything about that. | 
09-07-2006, 11:32 AM
|  | Faux Clay Nation | | Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Ontario Age: 30
Posts: 1,705
Chips: 4,340 | | | Re: Playing Kings Here you are definitely going to go all in.
As for how the other action went, you should have been the one raising to 300, then when/if the BB raises you, go all in and let him call with TT or JJ.
I hope he didn't have the set of jacks, but since you posted this I bet he did.
Mike
edit: just saw he had twos. Nothing you can do. | 
09-07-2006, 12:28 PM
|  | ChipTalk.net Article Writer | | Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boston Age: 25
Posts: 2,251
Chips: 5,912 | | | Re: Playing Kings your preflop raise of 1000 is a mistake. you have two options pf either call his reraise and see a flop most likely pushing as long as there is no A OR you can reraise all-in preflop.
your 1000 reraise commits you to the hand as you have put in over half of your stack, but you are giving someone with Ax odds to call (700 to call 1400 in the pot). Obviously you are looking at this from a results-oriented perspective, but if you assume he could have a pkt pair any Ax you either call and make a play at the flop or push pf.
good rule of thumb is to never commit over half of your stack pf...if your raise or reraise needs to be greater than half of your stack to be effective you might as well jam and try to take it down there. If you have AA its a little different as your odds are much better and you could have either called or reraise a smaller amount and made a move on the flop.
ignore the results (losing to a set with KK or AA is going to happen and there is nothing wrong with that) and focus on the play you made an whether or not it would be optimal giving your opponent a reasonable range of hands. | 
09-07-2006, 02:28 PM
|  | Poker Spellcaster | | Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: NLHE cash table Age: 39
Posts: 1,243
Chips: 13,756 | | | Re: Playing Kings Quote: |
Originally Posted by SeattleSooner I think I should have pushed pre-flop. | My thinking exactly. What's the purpose of leaving yourself 700 behind with a nearly 2000 pot? | 
09-07-2006, 04:07 PM
|  | World Series Champ | | Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Lakewood, CO Age: 37
Posts: 4,834
Chips: 1,861 | | | Re: Playing Kings I agree that he should have just pushed after that min-reraise.
At what point is his stack big enough to "get fancy" and raise less than his stack?
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