VENT - Bad, bad home tourney game last night

hachkc · #1 (**permalink**) 10-01-2005, 01:54 PM

Just had to vent about a NLH tourney I played in last and the ABSOLUTELY horrible play and UNBELIEVABLE luck shown by one of the players.

Here's some background: its a 19 man T200 tourney ($30 buyin) with 15min levels and starting blinds of 1/2 that double every level; kind of a turbo style tournament. One the players (father of another player, never seen him before) was just making these unbelievable calls with absolute garbage and winning the hands; lets call him the NOOB. Here is the hand he knocked me out with and the one 3 hands later he took someone else out with. Prior to these hands, I saw him make 2 other bad calls (not insane ones) that both paid off. I sure when I left, he was probably the chip leader. Need to find out how he finished.

First hand (9 players)
======
I'm in the CO+1 with A

2

and the blinds are 15/30 (5th round). Its folded to me and I raise it to 70. Everyone folds but the NOOB (in SB). The flop comes up 10 4 5 (2

). I go all-in for my remaining $87 (putting him on high cards) and he calls with an 84 offsuit (bottom pair). His bottom pair holds up and I get to watch from the side lines. I can't believe he called $55 from the SB with 84o and then called with bottom pair.

Second Hand (8 players)
=========
A few hands later, Ray (decent player bit of maniac) goes all-in preflop for $200+ from the CO+1. Everyone but the NOOB drops and they flip their cards; Ray shows 33 (he is bit of the maniac and blinds were about to go to 30/60) and the NOOB flips over 73 (sooted of course). Yes, the flop did have a 7 which held up.

Ray and I walked out at that point to discuss the "fine" play of our oppositiion in private; made for an early night.

Pavel6969 · #2 (**permalink**) 10-01-2005, 03:04 PM

Always seems to go that way doesn't it? Seen it many times. Nothing much can be done about it. You would see hands like that win a lot more times if the people who had them stayed in the pot, but most people have the sense to fold.

nianticcardplayer · #3 (**permalink**) 10-01-2005, 04:01 PM

Call me a bit of a pessimist but you went all in with Ace high or did you get your pair of dueces prior to going all in ? I mean its a gutsy call to call your all in with only a pair of fours, which at that point you are looking for a third two to beat the fours or an Ace either you are trying to beat what he has already. Not knowing what exact odds are or outs that you had (ie did some one else fold a duece or ace? so instead of 5 outs you may only have 1 or 2)but you are still kinda looking at one of those 55-45 hands and it goes away quickly as you don't pair up.

Plus depending on what the guys card game of choice is if he has money in already he will call no matter what, the black jack theory, I have my hand you have to draw for yours. On top of that some times these guys just don't get it?

I would have asked him why he called an all in with a pair of fours. You might have gained some insight on how to play him the next time. The seven three that's just a plain suck out.

hachkc · #4 (**permalink**) 10-01-2005, 04:29 PM

I was trying to buy the pot with nothing but A high and a gut shot straight draw; the 2

meant there were 2 spades on the board. I only had $150 with the blinds at 15/30 so I figured an all-in with a bad flop might be enough to buy the pot especially when he would have to put in about 90% of his remaining chips to call.

I found out later that this was the first time he'd ever played NLHE or in a tourney.

vrecksler · #5 (**permalink**) 10-01-2005, 07:16 PM

I would agree that moving all-in with nothing (given your chip stack and blinds, etc.) was not too bad against your everyday player but you tryed to bluff a NOOB! That is always a recipe for disaster because you know how noobs play; they will continually call down anything with nothing and if they pair something (even bottom pair) they will not hesitate to push. Especially since you had seen him call with garbage earlier in the tournament--did you realistically thought he would fold when he has already shown he will look anyone up? You have proven to be a good, solid player from what I have seen in the CT tournaments, I have to say you are too good for that.

Given all that information you had, I think your push was not a good move at all. Your bluff had no reasonable chance of success against that kind of player, so why risk putting yourself out? That is the kind of player you should LOVE playing against because it is easy money; if you have nothing you check and fold and if you have something you keep betting because you know they will stick around with inferior hands.

I hope I am not being too harsh or anything, I just see and hear stories like this all the time from friends and they are also decent players and it makes me wonder why all these good players are trying to put moves on players who don't put a lot of thought into the game.

R Deckard · #6 (**permalink**) 10-02-2005, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hachkc

I was trying to buy the pot with nothing but A high and a gut shot straight draw; the 2

meant there were 2 spades on the board. I only had $150 with the blinds at 15/30 so I figured an all-in with a bad flop might be enough to buy the pot especially when he would have to put in about 90% of his remaining chips to call.

I found out later that this was the first time he'd ever played NLHE or in a tourney.

You are going through what I went through before learning to adjust my game to the newbie factor. Basically, you can't buy pots/bluff/or be tricky, and you have to have cards to win. So you need to play straightforwardly, and if you are in a card drought, you will probably not win. On the flip side, you can bet huge if you hit, because you will get paid off every time. And you love when you both hit top pair, because usually the noob will be in kicker trouble ("the kicker" being a slightly more advanced concept). See my post in How do you beat Poker Dunces? for more tips.