[yaw]

i've been playing on TruePoker for years and really enjoy it. my favorite part is the fact that you can 'SEE' when a player takes another peak at their hole cards. generally, i would say the competition is very good there. caution, they do not have extremely LOW limit games. $1/$2 limit is the lowest i think. $25 max buy in w/$1 blinds is the LOWEST NL game running. anyone else play there?

[SpaceMonkey]

Am I the only one here that still likes Party? I've done quite well on 2-4 the past few months, and have moved up to 3-6 with good success so far.

I had one month were I cleaned up in the 30+3 SnG's too, and now play 50+5 most often. But I've been sticking to limit the past couple months. Most of the competition on Party is really bad, so I think it's still great.

[dad604]

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey

Am I the only one here that still likes Party? I've done quite well on 2-4 the past few months, and have moved up to 3-6 with good success so far.

I had one month were I cleaned up in the 30+3 SnG's too, and now play 50+5 most often. But I've been sticking to limit the past couple months. Most of the competition on Party is really bad, so I think it's still great.

Me too, about same level, maybe up to 5/10 limited. Nice easy games so far. It might get tougher as my bankroll increases and I move up but for now it is profitable.

[BZLuck]

I read this topic yesterday morning, and thought I would add a few comments to it after playing Pokerstars.com for money yesterday evening...

First off I mostly play poker for fun. The cash games that I play in are usually amongst very close friends, other than that we (the wife and I) mostly play for fun and sponsored prizes so that we can hold them in more public places. (Bars, offices, etc.) We bring the tables, chairs, cards and chips and set up for whomever requests it.

I've been playing the "play money" Pokerstars.com site for a while. It' a good way to just kill some time, and learn to read peoples betting habits and see some hand possibilities.

But I've become suspicious of the pay site of PS.com, and I'm not a paranoid guy. Read on.

I put $50 into a NetTeller account a few days ago and thought "why not" and started to play some .10/.25 no limit Hold 'Em. The play is tight, and when it's not tight, there's some "bully" at my table with a $100 stack going "All In" pre-flop to collect the $3.00 in blinds. I win a couple, loose a couple, think "this is OK" log out, and get through the rest of the work week.

Now, for the record I'm a decent player, not star quality, but no slouch either. In our "live" fun tournaments (usually about 16 players) it is a surprise if I don't make it to the final 3 or 4 players, I've won it a few times as well.

It seemed to me that the "randomizer" used on the PAY PS.com's site is just a bit different than on the free site of PokerStars.com.

What I mean by this is that it feels like (as in slot machines) the pay site of PS.com is "looser" than the free site. It seems like they post more potential winning hands than probability should allow, based on the number of players at the table.

Example, I log in last night, wife and her gf are out shopping, I pop a beer and flip out the wireless laptop for a little PS.com cash game. First hand I get pocket A's. Nice way to start. A little 50 cent pre-flop raise, called by one player, (the BB) and the flop comes up A K Q. I raise a bit more, only to be called "All In" for like $7 from the remaining player that called my raise pre-flop. I call. After the river and turn (both dead cards, like a 7 4) he flips a J 10. Nut straight beats trip A's. Dang, bad beat.

The VERY NEXT hand, I'm dealt an As 7s. I call the blind. The flop comes down 7 7 A. I've got it in the bag, right? Flopped a house? Well a different player has the AA THIS time, and beats my house with the higher one.

Two hands, lost almost $25.

The next hand I fold a 7c 9s pre-flop. The flop comes up 8 6 10 all hearts. Hmmm, I would have had a straight. The turn brings the Ah, river a 2c. 4 Hearts on the board. Glad I folded now. The two players that stay in and battle it out. At the flip, one has the Kh and the other the Qh. Two flushes and a straight in the same 6 player hand. Odd?

Now I've played enough hands to know that hands like these DO happen, but in about an hour of play, it seemed like there was at least one "killer hand" and one "almost killer" hand in more deals than not, and I logged out, returned the $17 I had left to my bank account, and swore off the site forever.

Total time played, about 1 hour in two sittings.

It just seems (I could be just getting horrible bad beats) that the "randomizer" for the pay site deals out more potential winning hands than would normally come up, to get the pots to grow higher, so the rake is increased.

Anybody else experience anything similar to this, or had the same feelings that I got in my first time gambling on-line for cash?

[BreakEven]

I've been playing the "play money" Pokerstars.com site for a while. It' a good way to just kill some time, and learn to read peoples betting habits and see some hand possibilities.

I don't play PS but I haven't found anywhere where people play the same for play money as real money. However, play money programs are a good way to get used to playing online and understanding the rules of the game IMO.

What I mean by this is that it feels like (as in slot machines) the pay site of PS.com is "looser" than the free site. It seems like they post more potential winning hands than probability should allow, based on the number of players at the table.

I feel your pain after reading your bad beat examples. Unfortunately, suckouts, bad beats, and premium hands losing to a better hands are not uncommon. Actually....I shouldn't say "unfortunately" because without these the game of poker would be a lot less exciting even though I hate being on the receiving end of a bad beat. Nevertheless, you make some pretty broad conclusions with only a few days of online play. Part of playing poker is being able to handle variance. If you're accustomed to almost always finishing in the money at home games, then you're going to have to make some emotional adjustments to the volatility that comes with poker, especially online poker. If you are a solid player, you should be profitable over thousands of hands and many tournaments.

[SpaceMonkey]

I think all the people who argue that online sites are rigged are full of crap. No offense to the poster here. These sites generate way too much income to need to boost their rake via "action" flops, etc.

In one of the examples given, you min raise with AA and consider it a bad beat when JT in the BB calls you and flops the nuts? That's not a bad beat.

[Aust1227]

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My advice is to go through www.ecasinodeals.com and sign up for Poker Rewards, play in this tourny, win, then win the 5Million.. Then you can give me 10% "finders fee".. Okay, maybe not all that, but if you want to use me as a referall when you sign up through Ecasinodeals, please feel free.

[warewulf]

Originally Posted by BZLuck

First hand I get pocket A's. Nice way to start. A little 50 cent pre-flop raise, called by one player, (the BB) and the flop comes up A K Q. I raise a bit more, only to be called "All In" for like $7 from the remaining player that called my raise pre-flop. I call. After the river and turn (both dead cards, like a 7 4) he flips a J 10. Nut straight beats trip A's. Dang, bad beat.

The problem here is you slow played your pocket aces and the J 10 called of course, because you gave him good odds. A 50 cent raise never gets enough people out. If you get pocket aces (as well as KK, AK, mabye QQ)in .10/.25 you need to bet at least $1.50 or more. I usually bet $2.

I have heard a lot of people say they think certain online sites are 'off' on their odds. I haven't heard one good arguement for it yet. It wouldn't be hard to prove a site is off, yet nobody has done it.

What I think we are dealing with is the fact that there are more hands per hour. This makes it seem like bad beats come more often.

[BreakEven]

What I think we are dealing with is the fact that there are more hands per hour. This makes it seem like bad beats come more often.

I agree that's a big part of it. I have also heard people argue that online play might be MORE random than home games. I believe it takes 5 to 7 riffles to truly randomize a deck of cards. How many times in a home game do we not shuffle that well? Half the time people are too lazy to cut the deck and just give it a tap when the cut is offered.

[BZLuck]

Originally Posted by warewulf

The problem here is you slow played your pocket aces and the J 10 called of course, because you gave him good odds. A 50 cent raise never gets enough people out. If you get pocket aces (as well as KK, AK, mabye QQ)in .10/.25 you need to bet at least $1.50 or more. I usually bet $2.

I have heard a lot of people say they think certain online sites are 'off' on their odds. I haven't heard one good arguement for it yet. It wouldn't be hard to prove a site is off, yet nobody has done it.

What I think we are dealing with is the fact that there are more hands per hour. This makes it seem like bad beats come more often.

Strategy point taken, but my experience was that a decent raise before the flop on these small money games usually ends up with you taking down the blinds of 35-65¢ in most cases. There is so much folding that you feel like you are in an origami classroom. :P

From previous hands I noticed if you put a $2 raise into a .10/.50 pot pre-flop and you are suddenly alone and the next hand is being dealt.

Anyway, call me all what you will, I have no proof, but just saw some really strange hands that I would be lucky to see in 2 nights of multi table tournament play, happen in an hour at one 6 person table.

Personally, it made up my mind, but to each his own.

I don't think they are "rigged" persay, but something felt fishy enough to me to leave on-line gambling forever after only two play sessions. I equate it as I did before more to being "loose" where card combos come up more often than the odds would dictate. And if anyone thinks this is impossible (I did not say provable!) then have at me.

Thank god I'm in Southern California and we can have live money table gaming at the Indian Casinos with about a 20 minute drive, 24 hours a day.

Make up your own minds, I'm forever finished with putting my money up against a computer.