Loose Passive Limit online?

Nanook · #1 (**permalink**) 09-05-2007, 12:24 PM

I have been playing at my local card room some lately. As far as HE, they only have limit. I am no limit expert at all, but I want to get better. I have been studying SSLE winning big with expert play by Miller and Sklansky & Malmuth. This book seems particularly well suited to the game at the card room as all the tables are 9 seated with nearly every hand having 6-8 players seeing the flop and most hands have at least 2 donks calling just about every hand all they way to the showdown even when they have absolutely nothing at all. This is not a one time occurance, but it seems to be pretty much that way every time I go. Obviously some times it is looser than others, but you get the picture. I am playing mostly 3-6 HE

I know everyone complains about this type of game and all the river draw outs by the donks etc, but I don't mind it so much and would like to learn to crush this type of game since it seems so easy to find (at least here.) Online I play almost exclusively at p* and this type of game does not seem to show itself very often if ever. The low limit HE games at p* seem to usually have about 3 players seeing the flop and the players seem to by MUCH tougher than they are at the local card room. Where can I find this type of game on-line to speed up the learning process?

Nanook

littlebu · #2 (**permalink**) 09-05-2007, 12:29 PM

online games like that are the super microstakes. .05/.10 .25/.50

edit: you can find games like that higher, not very often. Table selection is key.

TheMightyJim2k · #3 (**permalink**) 09-05-2007, 12:32 PM

short answer: you can't if you want to play for real money.

long answer: sometimes if you table select well you can find games that play like that at the lowest limits (.05/.10 to .25/.50) online. You can also find some fairly loose passive play at the play money tables, although it is tough to take it seriously since the play will be soooo bad and you'll tend to let your curiosity get the best of you.

In all honesty though you really shouldn't have to practice too much to beat those games if you understand Miller's SSH. He pretty much gives you all the tools to beat those games, and it really is just a matter of knowing what hands to play preflop, how to value bet the bad players to death, knowing how to count outs (and find hidden outs), and when to raise with a vulnerable made hand to improve your equity.

Unfortunately it is tough to find games like that online, but you might try the really low stakes games, or maybe some limit SNGs that will play like that for the first third or so before it gets shorthanded. To be honest with you, I've spent my last 75k hands online playing in tough aggressive shorthanded games, and I really think transitioning to one of those easy loose passive live games would be cake.

Nanook · #4 (**permalink**) 09-05-2007, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by littlebu

online games like that are the super microstakes. .05/.10 .25/.50

edit: you can find games like that higher, not very often. Table selection is key.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMightyJim2k

short answer: you can't if you want to play for real money.

Thanks guys. I was afraid that was the answer I was going to get.

Is this type of game common in card rooms everywhere, or is it just here? Vegas?

Nanook

dad604 · #5 (**permalink**) 09-05-2007, 03:24 PM

The players at local poker room in my area are even worse than Vegas. At the 24, 4/8, 6/12 level, there could be as many as 9 limpers.

I find skill level live vs online is 6 - 10 or more higher. ie skill at .50/1.00 online is better than 2/4 or 4/8 live.

TheMightyJim2k · #6 (**permalink**) 09-05-2007, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dad604

The players at local poker room in my area are even worse than Vegas. At the 24, 4/8, 6/12 level, there could be as many as 9 limpers.

I find skill level live vs online is 6 - 10 or more higher. ie skill at .50/1.00 online is better than 2/4 or 4/8 live.

I've recently talked with some online pros that say that 5/10 online is a significantly tougher game that 50/100 live. So from my experience I would say someone that could consistently beat 2/4 online could probably beat most 20/40 games live. 1/2 online is probably significantly more difficult to beat than all live games until 20/40 or higher. The players tend to play much more tight aggressive, and the ability to steal and defend blinds is one of the most important aspects of play.

Of course having the bankroll to play those loose live mid-stakes (20/40+)games is another situation entirely.....

Nanook · #7 (**permalink**) 09-05-2007, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMightyJim2k

I've recently talked with some online pros that say that 5/10 online is a significantly tougher game that 50/100 live. So from my experience I would say someone that could consistently beat 2/4 online could probably beat most 20/40 games live. 1/2 online is probably significantly more difficult to beat than all live games until 20/40 or higher. The players tend to play much more tight aggressive, and the ability to steal and defend blinds is one of the most important aspects of play.

Of course having the bankroll to play those loose live mid-stakes (20/40+)games is another situation entirely.....

From what I have seen I would have to agree. The thing I don't understand is where do all those guys playing 8/16 live and playing like complete donks at the card room get their money? I feel like I make pretty good money, but yet I certainly do not feel comfortable going in and dropping $1000 on a off night. I guess it is one thing to drop 1k on a bad night if you are a winning player, but I know most of these donks are certainly not winning players and it's like they don't mind running around with $100 bills falling out of their pockets left and right. I just don't get it!

Nanook

dad604 · #8 (**permalink**) 09-05-2007, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMightyJim2k

I've recently talked with some online pros that say that 5/10 online is a significantly tougher game that 50/100 live. So from my experience I would say someone that could consistently beat 2/4 online could probably beat most 20/40 games live. 1/2 online is probably significantly more difficult to beat than all live games until 20/40 or higher. The players tend to play much more tight aggressive, and the ability to steal and defend blinds is one of the most important aspects of play.

Of course having the bankroll to play those loose live mid-stakes (20/40+)games is another situation entirely.....

I feel that you are right regarding the higher limits too but that is something I don't have personal experience. Wish I could find higher games than 4/8 limit locally but they seem to have dried up except for one 20/40 limit game that is full of regular decent players.

I find it hard to beat the rake at the lower levels even tho there are 6 to 8 fish at a 10 player table. In the process of switching to NL now. Easier to find tables online and live at NL....Just hate starting at the bottom again.

Nanook · #9 (**permalink**) 09-05-2007, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dad604

............Wish I could find higher games than 4/8 limit locally .............

You should move here (Canterbury just south of Minneapolis, MN). Holy crap, 24/7 there are at least 5 or 6 tables of 8/16 full of donks and at least two or three tables each of 15/30 and 30/60. I don't know what the players are like at the higher limits because I never play at those limits and rarely even watch, but I have watched many many tables of 8/16 while waiting and they all seem to be just about how I described the 3/6 tables in my first post.

Nanook