[coyote]

Well after a substantial hiatus, I jumped back into online poker last night, signing up with FTP. Even signed up for rakeback this time.

Anyway, as others have mentioned, the games did seem tighter than PP. I managed a small win (only playing 1/2 LHE).

My question is, is LHE dying as the highly profitable game? Have more fish moved to the excitement of NLHE or other games?? Do I need to jump over to a 25 or 50 game??

Whaddaya sharks think?

[TheMightyJim2k]

SSLHE online has gotten significantly tougher in the last 18 months, it even did at Party. The reason being that recreational players who take the competition seriously are learning how to grind at the low levels, as well as many of the "lets give poker shot" fish went broke.

Despite that fact it is a still a profitable game. Table selection has become much more important, as well as the time of day you play. Playing in the evenings from 7-12 pm EST you will find the greatest traffic and the best playing conditions. It is a must that you adjust to the tables you are playing at. If the TAG's and rocks are at your table you need to tighten up significantly in early position, but attempt more blind steal in late position (or if they are quality players find another table). If you find some loose passives or reckless players its time to start limping into pots with medium strength starters and trying to flop big hands.

Also you could consider moving to shorthanded play. I have very limited experience with it, but I have heard that more loose gamblers are playing there and good players have a greater edge. Ed Miller (of 2+2 fame) suggests that you drop down a level to begin at 6 max tables so that the adjustment process won't hurt as much.

If you really want to win in the long run you should really consider getting pokertracker as it is the best possible way to find the fish and analyze your play.

sorry for the long reply but I am killing time at work before a meeting and this topic is something I had thought a lot about a few weeks ago. GL at the tables and hopefully I'll see you at FT.

[smoore]

If you want to play LHE, play 6max. Drop down to the very lowest level (forget that 1 level BS), it's a quite different game. Aggression is KING. The same may be said for NL, but I'm not good enough at NL to try yet.

FTP has very weak-tight games. Just wait until someone with the nuts lets you bet their hand for them... very annoying. 6max is better but there are few games compared to party.

I just got my FTP account converted to rakeback and am clearing a bonus there so Im'ma play that sucka. HOWEVER (why do all my posts have "however" in them?) I don't see myself playing there a lot after the bonus if the games stay the way they are. 'stars seems to be sucking in the casual players that are leaving party, the NL25 games have been GREAT the past two weeks. I know I'm getting better at NL but the quality of games can be seen just in the lobby. Two weeks ago you'd rarely see more than one game above 40% plrs/flop, this weekend I was on the list for 5 such games and they were GOOD when I got seats in the ones I chose.

Perhaps 'stars is the new party. There's no rakeback but the rake is the cheapest on the 'net and if you are a balla the VIP program works out to something like 22% 'back for mid-stake limit players and some 16% for NL players. If that's where the money is to be made, that's where you'll find me. I can finally say this because the money used to be made at party and I hated them.

Oh, and yeah... limit is capped out. NLHE is the new hotness, learn it, love it.

[coyote]

thanks for the responses guys. I do have PT and PAhud already.

smoore, can you briefly explain how the PS VIP program works? do you convert points to cash or something? I'd go try to find it on their website but I'm at work and it's blocked.

Perhaps I'll give PS a shot as well, but not until I get this $600 bonus cleared! For that reason I wonder it I'm better or worse off playing 6max... If I have to drop to the bottom of 6max, won't it take longer to clear the bonus? Or will the speed and action oriented play counteract that?

[Poboy]

One tip about 6max limit at FT - believe the river lead. If a guy on FT is calling you all the way, then leads at the river, he either just made his hand, or he was letting you bet his hand for him. At other sites, the river lead may be a bluff but not usually at FT.
They aren't all weak/tight at the 6max tables (although you will find the occasional rock), like the FR game seems to be full of.

[hachkc]

Originally Posted by coyote

smoore, can you briefly explain how the PS VIP program works? do you convert points to cash or something? I'd go try to find it on their website but I'm at work and it's blocked.

Basically, the VIP program is simply based on your FPP (Frequent Player Points) that you earn each month. FPP's are earned based on the rake for a given pot where you were dealt cards; the scale varies between limit and NL/PL games. Also, there are 5 levels of VIPs: Bronze (everyone), Silver (1500FPP/month), Gold (4k/month), Platinum (10k/month) and Supernova (1mil/year?). FPPs can be cashed in for merchandise (good selection) or various tourneys. Plus they offer monthly freerolls for Silver+ VIP members.

As for FTP, I'm playing there to clear my bonus and then moving back to P*.

[TheMightyJim2k]

frankly if you aren't playing 2/4 or up at Full Tilt you are probably going to be clearing that bonus for the full 4 months you have to do it. Their rake is very very low for the 1/2 and lower LHE tables and you just don't get enough rake to clear very much bonus. I have cleared $75 of mine playing about 2,500 hands of 2/4 but I think in the same amount of 1/2 you would probably only clear about $30. At that rate it is going to take 50,000 hands to clear a full $600 dollar bonus.

The six max games will definitely increase your dealt rake (rake for the pot divided by number of people dealt into hand) which is how you clear bonus at FT, but the variance might really hurt a limited bankroll. I guess you kind of have to make the call one what is best for yourself, but if you have little 6 max experience it can be a tough game to figure out when you first try. I use it as practice to tune up my blind vs. blind and defending play.

[smoore]

Above post is correct about the 'stars VIP program. I've only made silver once, when I played an absurd amount of $22 tournaments in a month. I'm no balla. 'stars does do a point -> cash conversion (started last week) but it's not that great. I'd probably just buy ipods and sell them if I was balla.

'stars VIP is best for people who play 5/10 LHE and higher.

re: the 6max thing: Drop down to the very lowest limit offered to figure it out. If you're running well and playing well then you could even jump right to your standard limit. I only recommend getting your feet wet down at the bottom. The bonus will clear VERY slowly. 2/4 shorthanded seemed to clear the bonus at about $5/hr for me last night.

[hachkc]

If you are looking to kill some bonuses, play O8 (L/NL/PL). The pots tend to be bigger than the same stakes at HE and if you play only premium hands (aka nut peddler), the variance should be small. For PLO8, the pots tend to be around 50-75% bigger for the same level of NLHE. Obviously, if you don't know O8 than this is bad advice.

As for the VIP, getting Silver in my opinion takes some effort and is probably about the best a serious, recreational player can get unless they are playing higher limits 5/10L or 1/2 NL. I've made Silver 3 or 4 times this year but I'm usually pushing it near the end of the month to get there; I think the best I ever did was 1800FPP. In order to get there, I needed to make an effort to get it but ended up loosing money those months.