[scottoc]

#Game No : 2629830146
***** Hand History for Game 2629830146 *****
NL Texas Hold'em Trny:15328842 Level:5 Blinds (50/100) - Thursday, September 01, 15:40:15 EDT 2005
Table Three-Table(444902) Table #1 (Real Money)
Seat 3 is the button
Total number of players : 7
Seat 1: maddenislife ( $2253 )
Seat 3: CUBUFFS111 ( $480 )
Seat 4: scottoc316 ( $950 )
Seat 6: rocksrev1 ( $3300 )
Seat 8: WallyGee22 ( $1062 )
Seat 10: all_in_008 ( $1185 )
Seat 7: klackdaddy ( $3145 )
Trny:15328842 Level:5
Blinds (50/100)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to scottoc316 [ Kd Kc ]
klackdaddy folds.
WallyGee22 folds.
all_in_008 calls [100].
maddenislife folds.
CUBUFFS111 folds.
scottoc316 calls [50].
rocksrev1 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ Jd, 2h, 7h ]
scottoc316 checks.
rocksrev1 checks.
all_in_008 bets [600].
scottoc316 is all-In [850]
rocksrev1 folds.
all_in_008 calls [250].
** Dealing Turn ** [ 4s ]
** Dealing River ** [ 9h ]
all_in_008 shows [ 4h, 4d ] three of a kind, fours.
scottoc316 shows [ Kd, Kc ] a pair of kings.
all_in_008 wins 2000 chips from the main pot with three of a kind, fours.
Player scottoc316 finished in 15 place
scottoc316 has left the table.
The Small Blind left the table. The Dealer button remains in place.
Game #2629834013 starts.

I didn't raise pre-flop because the BB had been overly aggressive.

[Pavel6969]

Ouch that one must sting. Pushing all in with a pair of fours! Stupid play, and stupid players always seem to catch what they need.

[chipper57AA]

stupid players always seem to catch what they need.

Actually its the good players who just remember the few times that play works out against them. More often than not the bad calls lose and they muck and you never see what they had.

[scottoc]

Luckily I wasn't involved but another case of idiocy rewarded.


#Game No : 2629645015
***** Hand History for Game 2629645015 *****
NL Texas Hold'em Trny:15328842 Level:1 Blinds (10/15) - Thursday, September 01, 14:54:36 EDT 2005
Table Three-Table(444902) Table #1 (Real Money)
Seat 2 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: maddenislife ( $875 )
Seat 2: Tengnips ( $975 )
Seat 3: CUBUFFS111 ( $805 )
Seat 4: Burritasvt ( $850 )
Seat 5: ElisaKF ( $1070 )
Seat 6: rocksrev1 ( $955 )
Seat 7: scottoc316 ( $1275 )
Seat 8: WallyGee22 ( $1000 )
Seat 9: MeatPiston ( $1000 )
Seat 10: all_in_008 ( $1195 )
Trny:15328842 Level:1
Blinds (10/15)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to scottoc316 [ Ks Jh ]
ElisaKF raises [30].
rocksrev1 calls [30].
scottoc316 folds.
WallyGee22 calls [30].
MeatPiston folds.
all_in_008 folds.
maddenislife raises [150].
Tengnips folds.
CUBUFFS111 folds.
Burritasvt folds.
ElisaKF raises [240].
rocksrev1 folds.
WallyGee22 folds.
maddenislife calls [120].
** Dealing Flop ** [ Kd, 5s, 9c ]
ElisaKF is all-In [800]
maddenislife is all-In [605]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Qh ]
** Dealing River ** [ Jc ]
ElisaKF shows [ Ah, As ] a pair of aces.
maddenislife shows [ Ad, Th ] a straight, ten to ace.
ElisaKF wins 195 chips from side pot #1 with a pair of aces.
maddenislife wins 1835 chips from the main pot with a straight, ten to ace.

[vrecksler]

Nasty, but I still think you should have raised pre-flop; if the BB is overly aggressive then that plays into your favour. Maybe he re-raises or pushes all-in, the pocket 4's might fold and you should be feeling good going up against the BB with your K's.

Of course in reality, the guy with the 4's would have called the BB's all-in and won a bigger pot because it seems as if no one on PP (and it may be the case on other places, I play exclusively at PP so I notice a lot) wants to release a pocket pair until they at least see a flop.

[scottoc]

No question I should have raised. But you are supposed to slow-play occacionally. And everything but the ending worked. Had him putting most of his chips in as almost a 7:1 dog. I've been knocked out of so many tournys the last few days as an overwhelming favorite it almost defys the odds. Wah, wah, wah, boo hoo

[Pavel6969]

When playing against other decent players, slowplaying can work. Playing against fish, it tends to get you in trouble more often that not because people will bet with anything. Seems that way to me at least.

[TheMightyJim2k]

i dont think we can knock his slow play here as it got the perfect desired result, and he got all of his money in as a 7-1 favorite. Can't think of a much better situation to be in.

You are right sometimes you have to slow play AA or KK or mix up your game, and there was nothing wrong with your play. You just got unlucky. Most of the time you want to raise, but this time the limp was fine.

good play, bad results...

[vrecksler]

Originally Posted by Pavel6969

When playing against other decent players, slowplaying can work. Playing against fish, it tends to get you in trouble more often that not because people will bet with anything. Seems that way to me at least.

I completely agree. When I am playing SNG's at PP I never try anything too fancy; if I hit something like top pair I bet, if I have nothing I fold. When I am lucky enough to hit a set I bet out in order to get some action, but no slow playing. Unless I flop a monster I do not want to give free cards because too many people will stick around and make sure they see all the cards--if I have a monster then that is OK but if I have something that can be beat I would much rather take it down.

[SpeakEasy]

I disagree that you have to raise pre-flop, and I disagree that Villain made a big mistake here (but he did make a mistake). Alternative analysis of this hand titled "How slow playing can be a mistake" or "Count the mistakes":

Scott all in pre-flop would likely have won a 250 pot. Scott first all-in on the flop would likely have won a 300 pot.

As played, opponent's call of 250 when the pot is 1750 is a perfectly reasonable action, and he would be a fool to fold in that situation. The fact that Villain bet on the flop after two checks is reasonable, although his bet of double the pot foolishly committed him to the pot. Only the size of his bet was the mistake.

In other words, if you hadn't doubly slow-played (call, check), you likely would have won a small pot instead of lose all your chips in a big pot. Unless you have the nuts, an uncontested pot is always preferable to a showdown, especially in a tournament when your opponent has you covered and losing the pot means tournament death.

I think limping with a big hand in the small blind is OK if you're on a stop-and-go. Call pre-flop, all in immediately on the flop. As played, you allowed a hand to price himself into a call.

Pavel, go back and review the hand -- Villain didn't just push all in with a pair of fours. He bet (although overbet) on the flop, suspecting weakness from all the checks. Only the size of his bet priced him in, and he absolutely had to call the last 250 for a 1700+ pot.

Better plays for both hands:

Scott all in on the flop.

Villain bet 150 on the flop when Scott checks. Then, when Scott moves all in and it costs another 700 to call (less than 2 to 1 pot odds), the pair of fours can fold.