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04-07-2005, 11:53 PM
| | Final Table | | Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 648
Chips: 298
| | | the matsui coin inlays are very nice eye candy wise, but too slick for my taste, im not a big fan of coin inlay chips. |
04-08-2005, 10:57 AM
|  | ·°· Chip Artist ·°· | | Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Toronto Age: 33
Posts: 1,336
Chips: 26,840
| | Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott The plastic in the coin-inlayed Matsui are much harder than the BJ coin-inlays. The samples of the Rounders Card Club sounds like crap because of the hard plastic. They sound like they would shatter into a million pieces if you accidentally drop them. | I'm not familiar with the "Rounders Card Club" chips, but I do have some coin inlay samples from Matsui. Assuming these are the same chip, I have to disagree.
I have a few BJ coin inlay chips, and they have 'sharp' edges, whereas the Matsuis have 'rounded' edges. These two chips have a similar sound, with the BJ having a higher pitch to it. I have no idea how you are measuring the 'hardness' of the plastic, but both of these chips are made out of hard plastic. If I take my fingernail to the edge of the BJ (with as much force as possible), I can barely mark it at all, but when I try this on the Matsui, I can make a small but more discernible mark. Not scientific, but also not indicative of a harder, more shatter-prone material.
The BJ has a slick/shiny surface to it, especially on the rolling edge, where the Matsui has more of a matte finish to it. To me the plastic finish and the edges are the biggest difference between the two, but I still like the Matsui metal inlay better. It's more of a taste thing, as the Matsui inlay doesn't look as shiny or 'silver' and has a bit of a darker tone to the metal. Looking closely at it, the Matsui inlay is perfectly centered, where the BJ is slightly off center. The BJ inlay also has a rougher edge where it meets the plastic surround. Now, the BJ chips are from a casino, so they have been used more than my Matsui samples, but I have several of each, and they are all the same.
J5  |
04-08-2005, 06:11 PM
| | On the Bubble | | Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 193
Chips: 145
| | Quote: |
Originally Posted by Johnny5 Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott The plastic in the coin-inlayed Matsui are much harder than the BJ coin-inlays. The samples of the Rounders Card Club sounds like crap because of the hard plastic. They sound like they would shatter into a million pieces if you accidentally drop them. | I'm not familiar with the "Rounders Card Club" chips, but I do have some coin inlay samples from Matsui. Assuming these are the same chip, I have to disagree.
I have a few BJ coin inlay chips, and they have 'sharp' edges, whereas the Matsuis have 'rounded' edges. These two chips have a similar sound, with the BJ having a higher pitch to it. I have no idea how you are measuring the 'hardness' of the plastic, but both of these chips are made out of hard plastic. If I take my fingernail to the edge of the BJ (with as much force as possible), I can barely mark it at all, but when I try this on the Matsui, I can make a small but more discernible mark. Not scientific, but also not indicative of a harder, more shatter-prone material.
The BJ has a slick/shiny surface to it, especially on the rolling edge, where the Matsui has more of a matte finish to it. To me the plastic finish and the edges are the biggest difference between the two, but I still like the Matsui metal inlay better. It's more of a taste thing, as the Matsui inlay doesn't look as shiny or 'silver' and has a bit of a darker tone to the metal. Looking closely at it, the Matsui inlay is perfectly centered, where the BJ is slightly off center. The BJ inlay also has a rougher edge where it meets the plastic surround. Now, the BJ chips are from a casino, so they have been used more than my Matsui samples, but I have several of each, and they are all the same.
J5 | Sounds like a challenge. 
Sound11: http://rapidshare.de/files/1187636/Sound11.mp3.html
Sound13: http://rapidshare.de/files/1187640/Sound13.mp3.html
Sound14: http://rapidshare.de/files/1187641/Sound14.mp3.html
Recorded by omnidirectional mic. All recorded at same settings converted to 128KB MP3.
The Matsuis have a very noticeable higher pitched sound than the BJs. Can be described as "crisper" as opposed to more of a "dud" sound on the BJ chips.
I'm not discounting the fact that the Matsui coin inlay chips have a beveled edge while the BJ have the sharp edge. That's a given.
> the Matsui inlay doesn't look as shiny or 'silver' and has a bit of a darker tone to the metal.
The Matsui coin looks mottled (very fine pitting) as opposed to the BJ which is smoother.
> Looking closely at it, the Matsui inlay is perfectly centered, where the BJ is slightly off center.
Looked closely and seems centered to me. These chips are all precision manufactured. I doubt Bud Jones (GIP) would allow tolerances deficiencies that would make something so off-centered that it's noticeable. This is not even an issue.
> The BJ inlay also has a rougher edge where it meets the plastic surround.
How would that affect the sound and feel of the chip? It's quite a nitpick.
I have older BJ Diecard coin inlay chips and those sound a little different than the BJ I've shown, but they still don't sound like the Matsuis. Not even close. |
04-09-2005, 01:26 AM
| | Final Table | | Join Date: Apr 2005
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| | | nice review |
04-09-2005, 02:22 AM
| | On the Bubble | | Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 193
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| | It wasn't a review. I was trying to debunk misconceptions of the BJ & Matsui coin inlay chips.  |
04-09-2005, 03:29 AM
| | Final Table | | Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 648
Chips: 298
| | ok nice debunking of the misconceptions of the BJ & Matsui coin inlay chips.  |
04-09-2005, 02:11 PM
| | ·°· Chip Artist ·°· | | Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Toronto Age: 33
Posts: 1,336
Chips: 26,840
| | Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott Sounds like a challenge. | No challenge, just expressing my thoughts/opinions. Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott The Matsuis have a very noticeable higher pitched sound than the BJs. Can be described as "crisper" as opposed to more of a "dud" sound on the BJ chips. | The 2 Matsui chips you recorded sound completely different to me. I have the pink sample chip & the sound 'pitch' between it and the BJ are similar, but I'm unconvinced that the Matusi has a 'noticeable higher pitch' to it. Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott > The BJ inlay also has a rougher edge where it meets the plastic surround.
How would that affect the sound and feel of the chip? It's quite a nitpick. | I never said it would. Isn't this a specialized "CHIP" forum, nitpickyness is a pre-requisite here isn't it? Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott It wasn't a review. I was trying to debunk misconceptions of the BJ & Matsui coin inlay chips. | What misconceptions are you attempting to debunk?
You slammed the Matsuis for being 'hard' and sounding "like they would shatter into a million pieces if you accidentally drop them", but you didn't even address the hardness/durability of the chips.
Even if you prefer the BJ chips (we all have our chip preferences), do you still believe that accidentally dropping a Matsui would casue it to shatter? Even if you don't like Matsui chips, you must at least admit that the BJ or Matsuis would both outlast any clay chip is a durability test. After all, they are made of plastic and metal!
J5 |
04-09-2005, 03:36 PM
| | On the Bubble | | Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 193
Chips: 145
| | Quote: |
Originally Posted by Johnny5 Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott The Matsuis have a very noticeable higher pitched sound than the BJs. Can be described as "crisper" as opposed to more of a "dud" sound on the BJ chips. | The 2 Matsui chips you recorded sound completely different to me. I have the pink sample chip & the sound 'pitch' between it and the BJ are similar, but I'm unconvinced that the Matusi has a 'noticeable higher pitch' to it. | The RCC Matsui does sound different than the Matsui sample, but the sound is closer to the sample than to the BJ. Quote: |
Originally Posted by Johnny5 Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott It wasn't a review. I was trying to debunk misconceptions of the BJ & Matsui coin inlay chips. | What misconceptions are you attempting to debunk?
You slammed the Matsuis for being 'hard' and sounding "like they would shatter into a million pieces if you accidentally drop them", but you didn't even address the hardness/durability of the chips. | Now, you taking what I said about "shattering into a million pieces" out of context. I never said it would shatter into a million pieces. I said IT SOUNDS LIKE it would... The key words being, "IT SOUNDS LIKE". Hardness of a material has direct correlation with the sound/acoustic property. I have addressed the hardness by comparing the acoustics of the chips. Quote: |
Originally Posted by Johnny5 Even if you prefer the BJ chips (we all have our chip preferences), do you still believe that accidentally dropping a Matsui would casue it to shatter? Even if you don't like Matsui chips, you must at least admit that the BJ or Matsuis would both outlast any clay chip is a durability test. After all, they are made of plastic and metal!
J5 | Not for a moment I think the Matsui would actually shatter. It just sounds like it may.
Have you tried to insulate a room for sound? Do you use a dense material (steel) or a something not dense (foam)? What would be the purpose in using foam to insulate a room? The purpose is to deaden the sound transfer. When deadening sound transfer, you are slowing down the sound waves (elongating them). Longer wavelength sound is lower/lower pitched than sound waves with a shorter wavelength.
As for hardness/durability of a material, do you make knives out of plastic (fast food knives) or out of stainless steel (restaurant knives)? Which would be more durable and last longer? The steel of course and it is harder and when dropped the sound is pitched higher than the plastic knife. Everything boils down to hardness/density have direct correlation with the acoustics of a material. That is your durability test analysis. |
04-10-2005, 12:44 AM
|  | | | Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Arkansas
Posts: 400
Chips: 957
| | | This is getting way to technical ! I have a set of both Matsui's, and Bud Jones. They are different. KC's, Rounders, and Murphy's are all Matsui's. They are excellent chips, and they get less slick as they break-in. Top of the line. Bud Jones speak for themselves. The BJ's are much older than my Matsui's. They have sharper edges, and appear harder to the touch, but they are excellent stackers. I think it has more to do with the suction created between the chips than the hardness. They FEEL harder than the Matsui's, but they stack better. I don't have a lab, but know how they feel from experience. Both excellent chips. |
04-10-2005, 11:09 AM
| | ·°· Chip Artist ·°· | | Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Toronto Age: 33
Posts: 1,336
Chips: 26,840
| | Quote: |
sounds like crap because of the hard plastic. They sound like they would shatter into a million pieces if you accidentally drop them.
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott Not for a moment I think the Matsui would actually shatter. It just sounds like it may. | Making a statement like that can sometimes be misleading - I was just trying to debunk a misconception  Quote: |
Originally Posted by ott Have you tried to insulate a room for sound? Do you use a dense material (steel) or a something not dense (foam)? What would be the purpose in using foam to insulate a room? ..... That is your durability test analysis. | I'm sure this these are valid points, but I think rather than using a chip's sound as a hardness reference, I feel that actually trying to mark the chip is a better test given the many variables that contribute to a chip's sound...
In this real-world test, the BJ seems to be the 'harder' chip.
J5 |  | |
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