[TRIPLE-D]

Where would the Monticito GB fall I wonder? It's NOT a replica of the chips used on the show. It's based on a fantasy casino, on a fantasy show? This might be a good example to use to define morally right/wrong, integrity,etc.

[tikipirate]

Originally Posted by TenPercenter

• I am not suggesting that ANYONE do policing. I'm suggesting a code that we can choose to agree with or not. If it is a good code, and people agree with it, that alone is enough to get folks aware that there is a problem with copies.
• I am not proposing "TEETH" in regard to enforcement of any type. No bans, no thread deletions, nothing official done by ChipTalk. I am looking for a Code that we can be proud to accept

If the Code is there, and some/most/all of us are happy with it and accept it, it will permeate the market. It will become something in the back of people's minds before they introduce a new group buy for the next cool looking casino chip.

I personally would sign on for something like that; however as other have pointed out, when new member's join CT and then propose copying the 2007 WSOP chips or ask where they can get copies of bellagio tournament chips, we need to remeber our position. I think too often people can get caught up in an idea and take things too far. I still don't know how it will play out if people choose not to become a party to this, but if there are no consequences per se, only "peer pressure" for , I'm for it.

My stance is that if this can eliminate some of the more blantant copies of casino chips I've seen, copies that I would say border on counterfited chips (which I have a real problem with), than I say let's give it a go.

[palmimports]

Originally Posted by TenPercenter

Maybe we should focus on the Pros and Cons of copies (or "strongly inspired"'s, or replicas... choose your euphemism). Joe started that a few posts back. Let try that approach, and I'll update the original post as we go. That'll give us a perspective of where people stand and that will lead us to drafting the Code.

Its your site- so if youre leaving it up to the masses to decide- lets to this:
1- apoll whether we even want the site to do this
assuming the majority agrees- THEN lets do a draft- a ct code of ethics
IF most members want this to happen then lets draft an agreement we to which we all will adhere


I _________ a member in good standing of Chiptalk.net- agree to the following guidelines regarding the design of artwork to be presented on Chiptalk for review and discussion regarding the potential for having said artwork made into a custom poker chip, plaque or other item gaming related

I agree that all artwork submitted on this website meets the following guidelines:
1- said artwork is original in design, concept and implementation and does not represent usage of preexisting artwork whether personal or commercial in nature
1a- If prior usage of existing artwork is - in part- used in the submitted design that said usage of existing artork bears no discernable resemblence to said existing artwork in such a manner as to be deemed duplication, in essence, of original design or conceptual design
2-All presentation of said artwork represents a diligent effort at original design whether as a collective effort of others, including but not limited to Chiptalk members, or as a single effort by myself
3- Prior to implementation of said submitted artwork that said artwork will be posted on CT for review and discussion as to its authenticity and potential infringement on prior existing artwork
4- If artwork design will be be marketed through CT channels then I agree to abide by any membership ruling regarding said authenticity or possible conflict to existing artwork design currently in production


Feel free to add to this or change/amend as necessary

THis assumes Greg just doesnt decide its his site and he will make the final decision regardless

[palmimports]

Originally Posted by TenPercenter

I'm not looking for "let me ask my lawyer what I can get away with." I'm not looking for "how many points of difference can I get away with to make this legal?"

I did not intend to propose a legal question, I meant to start the discussion about the ethics of copies.

you dont- but as a manufacturer I do- not just for CT but for countless other products we manufacture-

[TRIPLE-D]

This thread could change the landsape of this site for a long tine to come.

[smoore]

Don't make it something people feel coerced into e-signing.

Copycat chips are a big deal. People love 'em. As long as the legal stuff is taken care of, I say go for it!

So... instead of making it ct.net "suggested operating ethics" make it a club. An exclusive group of people who have signed a pledge that they will not "copy" chips. The definition of "copy" would be determined by the group.

The rest of ct.net can go about it's business, everyone doing their own thing, chipping along. People are making replica chips in Custom Chip Mockups while just two threads down there is the spark of the NextBigThing©

Say one day someone who came to ct.net because of a WSOP replica group buy and finds the C5 manifesto. "Wow, I was so foolish! Here I was worried about having these EXACT replica chips I completely missed this point! Man, I better find an artist!"

You have just taught a man to fish.

I'm not sure if I'd join the club but I know I wouldn't participate in a site-wide code.

I voted no

[mdow222]

I agree that copycat chips are not really good for the entire hobby. While some are really great looking, why not just create something new and unique without duplicating something that has been done. A code of ethics would be a step in the right direction.
FWIW

[John Chopek]

Why not place the the word "copy" somewhere on the chip? Thanks Again Greg!

[ky70]

I'm confused (but that's nothing new).

If this isn't for legal concerns, couldn't Ten just post a disclaimer on the front page (and specific forums as well) stating this site's code of ethics/stance on "Copy Cat Chips"?

[Jonah 99]

Here is a list of chips I think shouldn't be made:

Counterfit Casino chips
Hat & Cane knock off
chips that are just a copied inlay (ie reproducing a label of any existing chip and slapping it on a cheaper chip)
Any blatent attempt to confuse or mislead buyers by producing a chip that is in the spirit/theme of an existing commercial available chip (This would be something akin to me getting chips produce called Ra's or Ramses with an Egyptian theme and with the same or simular colors as Pharoes)


Some I don't have a problem with:
Past Tournament chips done in a different mediam (ie ceramic vs orginal clay) when said originals are not commercial available.
Tribute chips that are clearly labeled with a date or description as such, so as to not be confused or misrepresented as originals. (I think the newer Vineyards fall in this catagory as well as the New Yorkers)
Home use chips that use newly created artwork and designs of a theme that is not commercial available (Like the Hill Valley chips, it's an original design based on the Back to the Future movies, it uses no copyrighted artwork and there is no Back to the Future chips available, and they weren't made in mass quantities for resale, as far as I know)

I know that just because something isn't illegal it still might not be the right thing to do.
On the other end it's tough to say you shouldn't have something reproduced that is not available for people who'd like to have it.

It reminds me of a similar issue with music, movies and software.
There are titles that are not currently available, they are out of print.
Since there isn't enough demand for the copyright holders to re-issue the work it remains unavailable, so legally you can not attain a copy, and if you call/write to try, you get the same response palmimport was talking about: basically quit bugging me and just copy the thing. One person that got so tired of being bugged about it finally released what he could on his web site.
It was Lindsey Buckingham, he released mp3 of the tracks he did for the Vacation soundtrack since it was out of print and people kept bugging him.

Bottom line for me is I'm not out to rip any one off, and I wouldn't feel like I was by purchasing some sets that are not neccesarily 'original'

Hope this helps the conversation