[Mr Meaner]

Jimmy James I am calling you out to a heads up match. Are you in??

Alittle background, Jimmy is raggin me on how I run my tourneys

Originally Posted by Jimmy James

Rebuys and addon's = ****. I hate tourneys like that. Pay for a certain amount of chips, if you bust out, your ass is done! No 2nd chances.

My response

Originally Posted by Mr Meaner

Glad you got your opinion in there Jimmy!! I would love to have you over and put you in the loser's lounge when I bust your ass out of the tourney. You could play on the PS/2 while I counted all your chips.

John

Jimmy's Response

Originally Posted by Jimmy James

If I bust out, that is exactly what I deserve to be doing; playing PS2 while the people who don't play like morons and bust out in 30 minutes continue to play.

How a person plays their stack from start to finish should determine the winner. If you bust out of your original stack, you're done. Simple as that. Rebuys are for people who play like **** and need 2nd, 3rd or 4th chances, when others don't (yes I know sometimes you will get a bad beat, but that is part of poker).

Freeze out tourneys are the only way to fly, IMO.

And Meaner, I'm sure you're the best player on this site, and could bust out everyone. Let me guess, you're one of those guys who need rebuys in order to win.

So here's the deal Jimmy, Heads-up freezeout, you name the site and the stakes (I don't want to waste my time with anything less than $50) and well just see whose **** is bigger.

John

[ky70]

Heads up Challenges ....I like it!!
BTW, I agree with Mr. James with regards to bust outs

[panthershutch15]

Originally Posted by Mr Meaner

and well just see whose **** is bigger.
John

I would like to see a good ol' heads up brawl, just no genitalia.....I also am not a big fan of rebuys, but it is Meaner's tourney so he calls the shots.

[ky70]

Originally Posted by panthershutch15

I would like to see a good ol' heads up brawl, just no genitalia.....I also am not a big fan of rebuys, but it is Meaner's tourney so he calls the shots.

Agreed on all points

[boondocker96]

rebuys are brutal, but you know what you sign up for if you play in a rebuy tourney.
and yup, house rules are house rules...dont like it? then get the 'f' out.

[R Deckard]

I really don't see the issue with rebuys. There's two ways of looking at them:

• Gives the fish a way to throw away more money, and gives the good players a chance to recover from a ridiculous suck-out.
  
• Gives the good players more ammo to fire at the fish, and gives the fish more chances to suck-out.

Either way, the point is moot. The only real issue IMHO is that a rebuy tourney is better "marketing", i.e. it seems cheap to play in the beginning, but ends up being more expensive than just the initial buy-in. But a good player already knows that and should be prepared to spend more money.

[Wooderson]

Originally Posted by Mr. Meaner

...[We'll] just see whose **** is bigger.

Why not use a ruler?

[ky70]

Originally Posted by R Deckard

I really don't see the issue with rebuys. There's two ways of looking at them:

• Gives the fish a way to throw away more money, and gives the good players a chance to recover from a ridiculous suck-out.
  
• Gives the good players more ammo to fire at the fish, and gives the fish more chances to suck-out.

Either way, the point is moot. The only real issue IMHO is that a rebuy tourney is better "marketing", i.e. it seems cheap to play in the beginning, but ends up being more expensive than just the initial buy-in. But a good player already knows that and should be prepared to spend more money.

I'll have to disagee with you on this one Deckard. I think rebuys are unfair and make it more difficult for the best player to win. If I'm a decent player and generally don't bust out (or get low enough on chips) before the rebuy period ends, then I am up against players who have had more starting chips than me and even worse I'm faced with potentially having to knock out players more than once. Poker is difficult enough when played straight up, but when you add rebuys all the Yahoo's start to play a very risky game where the luck part tends to bite me in the @ss. In both the tournaments where I've played rebuys, the eventual champ was a guy that I personally busted who rebought and ended up "beating" me by sucking out. Rebuys increase the luck factor or at the very least allow more of an opportunity for luck to win out. I'm cool with Add-ons because everyone has the opportunity to get them but rebuys tilt the scale the wrong way IMO.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Originally Posted by ky70

I'll have to disagee with you on this one Deckard. I think rebuys are unfair and make it more difficult for the best player to win. If I'm a decent player and generally don't bust out (or get low enough on chips) before the rebuy period ends, then I am up against players who have had more starting chips than me and even worse I'm faced with potentially having to knock out players more than once. Poker is difficult enough when played straight up, but when you add rebuys all the Yahoo's start to play a very risky game where the luck part tends to bite me in the @ss. In both the tournaments where I've played rebuys, the eventual champ was a guy that I personally busted who rebought and ended up "beating" me by sucking out. Rebuys increase the luck factor or at the very least allow more of an opportunity for luck to win out. I'm cool with Add-ons because everyone has the opportunity to get them but rebuys tilt the scale the wrong way IMO.

I couldn't agree with you more, Deckard. Your points are dead on. I really don't understand the fuss. Better players should LOVE rebuys. In the long run, the better player is still going to cash more often and when you do cash, that cash out is going to be bigger thanks to all the extra rebuy money added to the pot.

Fairness has nothing to do with it. It's the rules of the game and they apply to everyone. How is that unfair?

There's one more BIG reason why I like rebuy tourneys. When I'm hosting an event that will likely last 3-4 hours, I really don't want my guests, some of whom travel and hour or more to be here, to be done in 5 minutes thanks to a bad suckout or some other set of circumstances that knock them out early on. With rebuys, I can ensure that my guests are going to get at least a good hour of gambling in as long as they're willing to potentially pay a little extra for it.

Even if I were against rebuys, that last point would sway me. I still don't get it though. It also always seems to be the better players I know that don't like the rebuy games. Just seems backwards to me.

[ky70]

Originally Posted by Spaceman Spiff

Better players should LOVE rebuys. In the long run, the better player is still going to cash more often and when you do cash, that cash out is going to be bigger thanks to all the extra rebuy money added to the pot.

This is probably the case, but in the short term (2 games) it hasn't worked out for me personally but the "weaker" players have benefited...but that's poker. I'm sure that in the long run my win rate would be about the same in rebuy tourney's as it is in freezouts, but the bottom line for me is that freezeouts promote better play...and I'm more interested in playing in a game with better play than I am in building the pot.

Originally Posted by Spaceman Spiff

There's one more BIG reason why I like rebuy tourneys. When I'm hosting an event that will likely last 3-4 hours, I really don't want my guests, some of whom travel and hour or more to be here, to be done in 5 minutes thanks to a bad suckout or some other set of circumstances that knock them out early on.

I'm with you here but I prefer to have a side table/game for the players that bust out and our tourney games don't generally last over 2 hours and we play between 3 - 5 tourney games on poker night. if it's only 1 big game for the entire night, I completely understand the need for rebuys.

On topic...I'd love to watch this heads up match if it happens online. I think Poker Stars has heads up tables.