[amstelnut]

Weekly cash game at my house Saturday night. .25/.50 with everyone starting in the $40 range. 9 players. Player 1 raises to $2.50 couple of folds and next player goes to $10. Player 3 directly to left of player 2 smooth calls $10. Player 1 goes all-in for $14 more. Player 2 calls all-in and player 3 moves all-in for $70 more. Player 2 goes in the tank for 5 min and eventually calls with AK suited. Player 3 shows AA and player 1 shows QJ off suit. Player 1 is a very loose player, but both other players are solid. Question. How is the call with AK a good play as player 2 claims? He says he put player 3 on JJ or 10's and was willing to gamble. My only problem is ealier in the night he laid down against a $45 all-in after the flop with an open ended staright draw and second nut flush draw. To me he had better odds with the post flop all-in than the second pre-flop call for more money. Sorry for the long post, but just trying to get some feedback from someone outside my regular group.

[StevenH72]

Calling there with AK is a bad call, and putting player 3 on JJ or TT is even worse imo, why would he be flat calling a 3-bet, and shoving after seeing a 4-bet called, imho that is showing quite massive strength.

As the OESD and 2nd nut flush draw, you are right (assuming that he would win if he were to hit) he has much better odds, and is slight favourite after that flop.

If I were you I would take note of player 2's plays and arrogant attitude here....quickly invite him back to your game and thank him for the money as he leaves.

[jdunford]

Originally Posted by amstelnut

Weekly cash game at my house Saturday night. .25/.50 with everyone starting in the $40 range. 9 players. Player 1 raises to $2.50 couple of folds and next player goes to $10. Player 3 directly to left of player 2 smooth calls $10. Player 1 goes all-in for $14 more. Player 2 calls all-in and player 3 moves all-in for $70 more. Player 2 goes in the tank for 5 min and eventually calls with AK suited. Player 3 shows AA and player 1 shows QJ off suit. Player 1 is a very loose player, but both other players are solid. Question. How is the call with AK a good play as player 2 claims? He says he put player 3 on JJ or 10's and was willing to gamble. My only problem is ealier in the night he laid down against a $45 all-in after the flop with an open ended staright draw and second nut flush draw. To me he had better odds with the post flop all-in than the second pre-flop call for more money. Sorry for the long post, but just trying to get some feedback from someone outside my regular group.

Which call confuses you? Player 2 raised to $10, as he should have (imo). He was getting pretty sweet odds of 3.14:1 ($14 into $44) when Player 1 pushed. Then he was getting 2.03:1 ($70 into a $142 pot, assuming he had Player 3 covered) when Player 3 pushed.

If he's up against a pair < KK, then he's nearly 50:50, so he only needs a little better than 1:1 odds against a single opponent. Most of the money is in the side pot. I don't want to bother breaking it down, but you could with PokerStove or whatever, and I'm guessing you'd find he needs ~ 1.8:1 or something to make this call if both have a pair < KK. If one opponent has an A or K, while the other has a pair, then it gets a little worse. And if an opponent has AA or KK (as one actually did), then he's pretty much screwed, but he could argue that's unlikely given he has AK - my famous last words (happened to me 4 times last night).

As for the straight/flush hand, there isn't enough information (namely size of the pot when it was raised to $45... and what was on the board); e.g., if the board just paired on the turn, and there was only $10 in the pot when a tight player pushed, then it's a pretty easy fold, imo.

[StevenH72]

Originally Posted by jdunford

Which call confuses you? Player 2 raised to $10, as he should have (imo). He was getting pretty sweet odds of 3.14:1 ($14 into $44) when Player 1 pushed. Then he was getting 2.89:1 ($70 into a $202 pot, assuming he had Player 3 covered) when Player 3 pushed.

is it not $70 into a $142 pot for player 2?

[jdunford]

Originally Posted by StevenH72

is it not $70 into a $142 pot for player 2?

You're right. That definitely makes it a tougher call. He'd need to be pretty certain he's not up against AA or KK at that point. Even still, it's pretty close given 2:1.

[amstelnut]

Sorry I am not straight on the pot amount, but I think even with close to the right odds its a terrible call. I believe it was 3/4 of player 2 chips stack to make the final call. Thanks for your guys insight.

[StevenH72]

Originally Posted by amstelnut

even with close to the right odds its a terrible call.

Surely if you have the right odds it can't be a terrible call by definition.

either way with the strength that player 3 has shown, I dont think player 2 can expect to ever be in a situation better than a good old hold'em race.

[PhilTheThrill14]

Originally Posted by amstelnut

Sorry I am not straight on the pot amount, but I think even with close to the right odds its a terrible call. I believe it was 3/4 of player 2 chips stack to make the final call. Thanks for your guys insight.

Its a cash game - it doesn't matter how much of his stack it was to call - that should never come into play.