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Old 07-15-2007, 01:51 PM
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Re: The De-evolution of Hold'em

Quote:
Originally Posted by smoore View Post

BTW, Sexton has an axe to grind with Unger... possibly because of Stuey's drug use, possibly other reasons. In any case, you'll only ever hear Sexton give Ungar praise in a backhanded manner.

Stu was a card savant. He played card games on a level none of us will ever glimpse. The only reason he started to play poker is that no one would play gin with him any more. No one. Nowhere.

Add raw talent like that to a game like NLHE and you've got a winning, dangerous maniac. I think Gus Hansen could possibly be as good as Ungar but more people know how to counter that style now. There's a good fantasy HU match, huh? Ungar vs. Hansen... $10k, winner takes all!
I have to respectfully disagree with some of these points. I've read Nolan Dalla's bio on Stuey and I've seen several live interviews where Mike Sexton discusses his feelings on Stuey. I've seen him cry just a couple words into a sentence. I've certainly seen praise and admiration that wasn't done in a back-handed fashion.

Hansen will never be Ungar. Gus Hansen is not as aggressive as people believe. It is a misconception of vocabulary. Gus is a loose or active player, as Barry Greenstein pointed out on his site. He makes continuation bets on the flop but surrenders to reraises. Maniacs don't fold to reraises, they shove all-in when reraised.

Barry Greenstein: "Gus is often mischaracterized as a hyper-aggressive player when he is actually an active or loose player. He plays a lot of pots and his success is a combination of this volatile style and good decision-making after the flop."

I've watched the 1997 finals of the WSOP multiple times (I own the tape). Ungar was a much different player at the end of his life. He flat-calls with AQ and lets a guy with AJ hang himself by leading out, then when he checks the river, Ungar makes a nice value bet and is paid off. If you observe 97' Stu, he is wiser and a lot more poised. He never throws a fit or makes a sound, he is very worn down from life, but his mind is still sharp. I think Gus makes a lot of poor decisions. He makes some horrible calls pre-flop with marginal hands and he shoves it in with Q-high and middle pairs, with absolutely no fear of being dominated. With his backgammon background, he should be much better at the math of poker. He seems to understand pot odds, but not hand match-ups.

The biggest similarity between Hansen and Ungar is neither will be remembered for big laydowns, they both invested too much in medium-strength hands like top pair.
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